"It feels really good to empower others:" An interview with Gavriella Schuster
Gavriella Schuster is one of the best-known advocates for greater diversity and inclusion in the tech industry. She explains why allyship is so important, and how greater inclusion benefits everybody.
A former Microsoft executive, Gavriella Schuster founded both the Women in Cloud and Women in Tech network and is, among multiple board positions, currently Advisory Board Chairwoman at AI platform provider Artificial Solutions. Her TedX talk on allyship has racked up in excess of 40,000 views.
Despite genuine efforts to attract more women into the industry at junior levels, the representation of women at mid-tier and leadership level remains depressingly static. By some measures, women have actually gone backwards since 2018. Why does Gavriella Schuster think this is happening?
"Because the culture continues to be non-inclusive," she says. "The core belief system, the way tech companies grow up reinforces that it's not inclusive. More women are entering the STEM fields but when it comes to actually working in tech, more women enter but then leave.
"The culture itself doesn't encourage women or really, any marginalised group to thrive in that environment. It is such a tight, bro culture."
The persistence of this culture flies in the face of the economic logic of diverse leadership. The World Economic Forum sets out the case, showing that companies in the top quartile for gender diversity on executive teams were 25% more likely to outperform bottom quartile companies in terms of proftability. Top-quartile companies were 36% more likely to outperform bottom-quartile ones in return on equity. The companies tracked for this research were not just tech organisations, but you certainly won't find many tech employers who aren't publicly pledging their commitment to greater diversity. The problem is that it tends to stop at the pledges.
Does Schuster believe that the business case for greater diversity needs to be remade?
"I do think that there is understanding of the case for diversity from a business perspective and that's why I shifted to focus on allyship because what I've found is that it is that culture of inclusion that doesn't seem to exist. Why doesn't it exist?"
Tired of having been the only women in the room on so many occasions, Schuster set out to not only answer this question, but provide ways to create inclusion.
Becoming an ally
Schuster put together an actionable framework for businesses leaders seeking a more inclusive culture. This framework is summarised as BeCOME. There are four actions that anyone can take to become an ally: Connect, Outreach, Mentor and Empower.
"BeCOME is about how do you actually create more gender equity in your organisation. How do you hire for diversity? Build diverse pipelines, etc." Schuster explains.
#ALLIES builds detail about the behaviours that ALLIES can demonstrate everyday: Advocate, Listen, Lift, Include, Elevate and Sponsor.
"ALLIES takes off from the "E" in Empower," Schuster explains. "How do you create that more inclusive environment? I've worked with several organisations that have taken the BeCOME and those four steps and implemented structured networking outside of their organisation, revamped their hiring practices and then implemented a more structured mentoring programme on the ALLIES side."
"I have these fixed actions that I coach people to take, as they want to create that more inclusive environment. I've had really positive response from that. It's a little bit harder because those aren't necessarily programmes an organisation would institute. It's more norms that they would create but organisations I've consulted with around it, have really embraced that as their cultural norm, and it's starting to gain some great traction."
Despite some individual organisations genuinely rising to the challenge, Schuster believes that the technology industry as a whole has an extraordinary amount of work to do.
"Overall on the industry side I feel like we are really struggling," she says. "Growing up as as a woman in tech, it's hard to discern what is really you and what is systemic. You get feedback like ‘Oh, you're too aggressive,' but then parsing that feedback you think, ‘would you say the same thing if I was doing the same thing as a man?'
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"It feels really good to empower others:" An interview with Gavriella Schuster
Gavriella Schuster is one of the best-known advocates for greater diversity and inclusion in the tech industry. She explains why allyship is so important, and how greater inclusion benefits everybody.
Creating a toolset for allyship
Schuster believes that the majority of the men who dominate the technology realm are not deliberately discriminating against women. Most of the time, they either just don't see what's happening or if they do they are unsure about how best to respond.
"My theory is that about a third of the men in the room see those microaggressions and inequalities occurring, but they have no idea what to do about it. Then you have around 40% in the middle, who are so wrapped up in their progression and their own universe that they actually don't even see it happening. Then you have that bottom third doing it intentionally."
ALLIES is aimed very specifically at the 70% who either see the microaggressions that women are continually subjected to or are blissfully unaware of their existence.
"What I try to do is provide tools on what to say and what to do and how to do that more effectively. It's about how to raise your situational awareness, how to start recognising what those microaggressions are, and naming and listing those common microaggressions that in many cases go unnoticed.
"They don't notice that the woman in the room is getting interrupted five times more often than anybody else. Or that she said something and that thing gets repeated by somebody else who gets the credit for what she said. When you name these microaggressions the reaction is often, ‘yeah, I get what you're saying but that doesn't really happen in my organisation.'"
Schuster then asks the men involved to intentionally focus on noticing these microagressions, and also to take note of who does the office housework - getting coffee, taking notes, greeting guests, organising out of work events etc. This is the first step to raising situational awareness, because men realise what they haven't been seeing.
The next step is equipping men with the tools to be an effective ally to women, and Schuster is crystal clear that the aim of this exercise is not to blame or shame anyone. The goal is to raise awareness of the unfairness of the existing environment and equip men with the tools needed to support their female colleagues.
These are tools needed to respond in the moment. What do you say or do so that you're not blaming or shaming somebody who has no idea what they just did?"
Schuster also pinpoints one of the most significant hurdles that women face, which is that if they object to being treated differently to their predominantly male colleagues, they're often punished later on by being told that they're too aggressive or defensive. What is perceived as natural confidence in men is perceived as aggression in women.
"The goal is that the woman who has just been interrupted or asked to take notes doesn't have to say, ‘you just interrupted me or why do I have to take notes?' Because then you get the feedback saying you're defensive and not a team player.
"But what if someone else says something like, ‘I think that Gavriella wasn't quite finished. Can you just finish your thought? I'd really like to hear it.' That gives me confidence that helps the room understand that I was speaking and start to key in and listen. These are things that create that inclusive environment and that I think would change that dynamic where women just give up because they realise that they can't be effective in that situation."
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"It feels really good to empower others:" An interview with Gavriella Schuster
Gavriella Schuster is one of the best-known advocates for greater diversity and inclusion in the tech industry. She explains why allyship is so important, and how greater inclusion benefits everybody.
It's not just about women
It is clear that Schuster has given a great deal of thought about how best to overcome one of the most frequently encountered objections to any kind of initiative to create a more inclusive culture, which is that white men feel as if they're being attacked and subsequently rail against any attempt at change.
"I had to think about where I could actually make an impact. I want to help men become allies and to understand that their behaviour matters. They have to be very intentional about it and it takes a lot of courage to do that. So here are the words to say and things to do that can be helpful.
"And it's not just being an ally to women, it's being an ally to everybody. Everybody at some point in time has felt like they're outnumbered. Everyone has felt that they're singled out or excluded for some reason in a group. Being an ally as a leader is to recognise when that's happening, and to take active steps to bring that person back into the conversation. That's inclusion, and it makes a better environment for everybody."
The BeCOME and ALLIES programmes are thoughtfully crafted and its easy to envision how they can be used effectively and positively. But there will always be a minority of men who would prefer the patriarchal norms that Schuster is trying to chip away at to remain unchanged, and those who perceive attempts to make organisational culture more inclusive as a zero-sum game.
"The way I try and help those who think it's a zero-sum game is to communicate that in an organisation that's inclusive, everybody can thrive. It helps everybody to be authentic. It starts to eliminate the corporate politics and that's good for everybody.
"My dream is that I can get Ally Enterprise Resource Groups (ERGs) in every organisation. One of the challenges for white men if you think about it from their perspective is that ERGs support women, Hispanic communities, Black communities and white men feel excluded from ERG culture. If there was an allyship ERG that they could join, and understand and learn how to be an ally for all of these other groups it would give them a home in that ERG community."
Schuster's belief that everybody can and should benefit from more inclusive culture in the tech workplace is sincere and passionate.
"For me, the definition of an ally is someone who uses their privilege or power and shares it with others to empower them. It feels really good when you empower someone else. And it's all simple things like listening with intention. This means you're not listening in order to respond or to solve the problem, or thinking about what you're going to say or your point of view, but listening to try and understand what somebody's saying. When or if they say something that doesn't fit with your experience, try to be curious and say, 'that's different than the way I see the world so help me understand how you came to that.' That's truly listening and it makes the person you're listening to realise that you truly care which means they will help you to understand their position.
It opens up the dialogue as opposed to shutting it down."
"Similarly, if you are focused on being critical and tearing something down in order to build it up (which is very tech culture,) then you're creating exclusion. You're tearing down somebody's confidence. Instead, focus on how you lift up what that person said, acknowledge what they've said, acknowledge the value in their contribution and provide ways to give them confidence.
"These are not monumental things to change about the way you are. These are simple things you do every day. They make you a better leader. And they create an inclusive environment and they make you an ally. And what you will find is the level of engagement and retention from the women in your team will change dramatically for the better."
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